In John Dorsay  wrote:
> On 2/4/2010 5:02 PM, wrote:
>> In Andrew Robertson  wrote:
>>> Meat body:    Look both ways, assess the speed of oncoming traffic and when 
>>> deemed safe move swiftly across.
>>> Dream body:  Postulate invincibility, close eyes and wander across slowly.
>>      Nice nitwitism.
> I mean no disrespect to your views, Homer, but I can't find a flaw
> in Andrew's summary.  If we do inhabit dream bodies, and our
> perception of our own existence is not part of some independent
> physical reality, why can't we use Andrew's technique?  To dismiss
> the technique seems to acknowledge that meat theory trumps dream
> theory, does it not?

     You can answer this one yourself with a little thought.

     A being can not simply counter postulate a dream rule,
without first erasing the creation of the dream rule he no longer

     If the being can be responsible for making the postulate
that the wall is solid and he can't just walk through it,
then he can take that back and make another one that says
walls can be walked through.

     But he can't TEST his theory that he created the first dream rule,
merely by trying the second rule out.  It will fail, because the first
dream rule is still in place and only a perfect duplication of its
original creation will void it.

     An OT can create a new dream rule that says he can move
the marble because he can replicate the creation of the original
dream rule that he can't move the marble.

     Consider a sleep dream.

     A dreamball CAN create a dream in which he can go through things,
but a dreamball CAN also create a dream that doesn't allow him to do so.

     A dreamball can virtualize any kind of rules in the dream he wants.

     Once a dream is created and committed to with enough (false)
conviction, the being's convictions rule.

     It is imperative the being not know he is dreaming for the
convictions to really set in to become 'reality'.

     Simply asking if one is dreaming, but not really knowing, usually
will not change the rules held in place by conviction.

     But they can sometimes if the convictions are not so solid.
     Even knowing one is dreaming for sure, doesn't always free up the
rules to be changed.

     Sometimes the rules are so lose, that one DISCOVERS one is dreaming
because one walked through the wall unintentionally and that woke him up
to it being just a dream, or if doesn't wake up outright, he goes lucid
for the rest of the dream having fun walking through walls.
     Fully waking up from the dream, would I would assume open the door
to changing those convictions and thus the hardball nature of the dream
when one entered it again.

     Everyone is bound by their own rules, in a common dream, those
rules are the same for everyone but only by their own agreement.  If
someone wakes up, and changes the rules for himself, AND if that's ok
with everyone else in the dream from original design postulates, then he
can reenter the dream and break the rules everyone else is bound by.

     Other's probably won't appreciate it, as it will tend to wake them
up too, and they really badly want to remain in the dream.

     That a being hasn't yet figured out how to wake up enough from the
dream to change its rules, or hasn't found the rule that allows him to
change the rule, doesn't mean it isn't a dream.

     I trust you have done the experiments in a sleep dream.

     I have many many times.

     Sometimes I can walk through walls, if I chill out enough,
sometimes I can't.

     Sometimes I can fly, sometimes I can't.

     These are sleep dreams, so what exactly is the difference between

     Sometimes abilities are free and loose in a dream, sometimes they

     Sometimes I think I am awake, only to wake up 10 minutes later.
Then I wake up again, and again and again.

     Sometimes I wonder if I am dreaming, but try to wake up,
can't and conclude I am not dreaming.  Only to wake up later.

     Dream rules are as you or someone makes them if the dream
is not your original creation.


> John

Homer Wilson Smith     The Paths of Lovers    Art Matrix - Lightlink
(607) 277-0959 KC2ITF        Cross            Internet Access, Ithaca NY    In the Line of Duty
Thu Feb  4 21:19:16 EST 2010