Homer Wilson Smith ( wrote:
>     IT's ok to not offer proof.
>     It is not ok to use force to make people put up or shut up.
>     This is quite clear.

CB Willis ( wrote:
>Yes. Some claims don't lend themselves well to proof to others.

     Yes and some claims lend all too well to proof to others with
disasterous consequences.

     You can always tell a 'Prove it!' case.

     They refuse to deal with the issues of a prime directive.

     They see no danger to proof, and they see no usefullness to
things that can't be proven TO them BY others.

     If God exists, they need to see that themselves, no way can I
prove to them I have seen God myself etc.

     They are a know before you go case, "prove to me God exists, then
I will look to see for myself."
     However if I have seen God, certainly I should say so.

     So what is the correct answer to 'Put up or shut up!'

     Basically nothing, they have already ceased communication.

     One shuts up TO THEM, but of course not to others.
     Truth is the 'Prove it!' case wants you to shut up to others and
is in fact trying very hard with his "non existent" OT powers to shut
you up.  So although they may not be overtly doing anything with their
bodies to shut you up, they most assuredly ARE trying to do something
with their minds and OT intent to shut you up.

     Failed OT efforts are a major area of charge on 'mere' mortal
humans who continue to try to commit OT overt acts long after they
don't believe in them any more.
     Attempted murder is just as bad as murder.

     Wished murder is attempted murder at the OT level.

     Wished silence is similar.
     All are guilty until confessed.

     The real problem is that an OT is not human any longer.

     An OT is something that CREATES human's and puts them in
contexts.  OT's create tapestries of good AND evil and sets them in
motion.  Humans of course, trying to be good, find this an anathema to
their own existence.

     This is in part why humans don't want anyone BECOMING a god.
     I mean if someone became a god and started making other beings
and sticking them on planets where they could and would be eradicated
by plague, pestilence, famine, catastrophe and fear, not to mention,
volcanoes, earthquakes, and asteroids, most humans would look pretty
dimly upon such a creator.
     They try to excuse God by saying its all the creatures fault etc,
but in fact looking into the eye of God, one finds the Infinite Artist
using paints of infinite good and evil, and not warm fuzzy humanness.

     Warm fuzzy humanness is only one color on the God's palette, and
the other colors are hard to behold.

     So an OT is really quite UNhuman, for only an UNhuman would
create a human, but to a human they look very INhuman, and this can
lead to great danger for the OT, who is after all not all powerful,
and for those he cares about who may not be OT at all.

     OT's can be corraled and controlled by torturing their friends,
if they have any shred of humanness left in them.
     The utter refusal of the 'Prove it!' case to deal with these
issues proves they are unworthy of further comment or consideration,
except to watch out for their suppressive intent, and are swine before
whom pearls should not be thrown lest dire consequences arise to all
involved including the 'Prove It!' case.