.ll 72
.fo off
.co on 
.ce ((Editor's comments in double parenthesis - Homer))
.ce ADR - 316
.ce Copyright (C) Homer Wilson Smith
.ce Redistribution rights granted for non commercial purposes
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Date:         Tue, 27 Jun 89 18:29:13 EDT
From:         Homer 
Subject:      Re: Homer's Ravings: An Experiment in Stupidity
To:           Adore-l list 
In-Reply-To:  Message of Tue, 27 Jun 89 18:11:17 EST from 

>(1)  You imply that there are a fixed number of souls in the universe.  Is
>this true?  Why?  Or Why Not?

     SOURCE is a system of an INFINITE number of INFINITE MINDS plus
the underlying physical ground necessary for all of their abilities.

     In this ONE UNIVERSE there may or may not be a finite number of
those souls.  I would say there probably are only a finite number of
souls in this universe, but it may be in an expanding part of its cycle
and new souls may be entering it at any time.  Also souls are going
clear, getting enlightened, reaching Nirvana or what ever you want to
call it, so they are probably leaving the universe.  Possibly many more
are entering at this stage than are leaving it.

     In my opinion, just as our entrance in to bodies was the result
of prior spiritual disasters with bodies and before, our entrance
into this universe is the result of prior disasters in the universe
just out side or before this one.

     From my 'research' into myself, I would surmise that there have
been upwards of 18 different universes before this one FOR ME.  Each lower
universe was a SOLUTION to having fucked up in the previous one.

     IN each lower universe we enter with much power but little knowledge
of how it works, often with delusions of just having been created anew
by an all powerful all loving God whose purpose we want to further.
Nothing is remembered of the previous universe as such memory would
conflict with the idea of having just been created by the God of
the universe we are now in.

     Eventually spirits reach ROCK, this universe.  What happens next
if they do not figure it all out is beyond me.  It looks terrible
beyond imagination.  Only higher visions from states prior to all
universes have shown me some hint that ALL are saved one day, due mainly
to the fact that time is finite.  The game MUST end.

     Even though we are INFINITE MINDS which means there is no finite
limit to how much space or time we can create, we can none the less only
create a FINITE amount of time and space at once.

     You can create as much as you want, but it has to be finite.

>(2)  You have consistently stated that your research into your phenomenology
>and dogma is scientific in orientation.  You have already come under virulent
>attack for refusing to support this, and I for one have no intention of
>starting it again.  However, I do feel you should qualify your statements
>for those newcomers to the list, or those who have forgotten the exchange of
>tireades.  As far as I have  been able to remember, the scientific method
>involves more than simply experimentation, but also includes such things
>as the control concept, and verifiability.  I know you are unwilling to release
>publically any information which might fulfil the second part, so...
>can you help me at least with the first?

     Your concerns are totally valid.

     From ADORE,


     RELIGION, SCIENCE, ART and BUSINESS and in reverse order to

     The purpose of SCIENCE is to DISCOVER what was CREATED by SOUL,
in order to put it to USE (ART) and have something to DO with it,

     Thus science and religion are not in conflict.

     The scientific method involving discovery, does not conflict
with the religious method which is creation.  Not creation of
scientific ideas the way low level people do, but creation of
entire universes in which to discover things.  At this level of God
operatingness, Religion creates world views out of nothing, by
creating the world out of nothing in the first place.

    It is then up to science to discover and show what the soul
or souls co created.

     Thus ADORE is a science too, it is a science of QUESTIONS and ANSWERS.
As a religion it states that the ANSWERS are CREATED first, then
a NOT KNOW is created by the soul in order to have a game,
then as its own CREATURE, the soul wanders in the universe trying to
to find QUESTIONS to answer.   Further as a religion it says some
pretty strange things about how to answer questions.

     Since the NOT KNOW is created by the soul itself, and since the
ANSWER in the form of the world was also created by the soul itself,
as a RELIGION, ADORE says you can get rid of the NOT KNOW and come to
know the answers directly via operating the primary basic operating
principle 'the way in is the way out'.

     This means by re creating the NOT KNOW, it should vanish and
leave you with the original answer.

     Thus as a RELIGION, Adore say the following about HOW to know.

     You can KNOW anything by NOT KNOWING.
     You can NOT KNOW anything by NOT KNOWING.
     But only if you PRIDE NOT KNOWING.

     The pride it is talking about is the original pride used in the
creation of the answer and the not know in the first place.

     If you feel ashamed of not knowing, then you are denying
responsibility for your not knowing, and of course the not knowing
is not being made again exactly as you originally made it, and so
it will persist.

     But all this religious gobbledygook aside, there is also the
SCIENTIFIC way of going about knowing.  Rather than using the upper
level magic to vanish not knows created by you,  you can use the
scientific method to establish how things work.

     This would be the route of PLAYING the game rather than UNMOCKING
the game because you were sick of it.

     Thus every principle of ADORE or any religious claim at all
should be verifiable, repeatable, and what ever else the scientists
insist upon.

     My trepidation about giving out experiments or experiences
upon which I base my conclusions is not an absolute.  Those who have
no interest in the truth can and will abuse the data in order to
make less of it.  However it is all there and can be communicated just
like anything else.

     However, remember, that MY having seen Immortality, does not
prove to you anything until YOU see YOUR Immortality.

     I submit you can not even prove that I exist, and I can not
prove that YOU exist.  I can only prove that I exist, and You can only
prove that You exist to yourself.  However once I have done the experiment
that proves to me that I exist, I can get you to do that same experiment
for yourself.  Thus IF YOU DO EXIST, you will also have such proof FOR

     Thus the scientific method might have to be altered a trifle given that
consciousness is only certain to its own bearer, unlike the supposed
external physical universe which is certain to everyone.

     But that is a joke, because the external universe is what we are the
LEAST certain of because we use our consciousness to find out about it.
We always learn about the outside world via a VIA.

     Anyhow, your questions are very valid, and I am going to leave
this letter in my reader along with the other serious postings on this
matter, and will come back to it at length after I have had some time
to think further on it, and answer the older postings still hanging out.

 Homer               Adore-l list         6/27/89*Homer's Ravings: An Experimen