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.ce ((Editor's comments in double parenthesis - Homer))
.ce ADR - 487
.ce Copyright (C) Homer Wilson Smith
.ce Redistribution rights granted for non commercial purposes
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Date:         Mon, 25 Sep 89 14:55:31 EDT
From:         Homer 
Subject:      Re: Homer wants to know if I'm gay
To:           Adore-l list 
In-Reply-To:  Message of Sun, 24 Sep 89 09:08:05 MDT from 

>>     Mark Hayes is gay.  Just a guess. ...
>>     I suspect that if Mark IS gay he will admit it ...
>>     I am sure Mark would not lie about such a thing, although he
>>may tell us it is non of our business.
>>     If he did that though, that would mean he was afraid of homophobes.
>I'm not sure how to respond to this little bit of "fag-baiting".
>If I say I *am* gay, Homer will clap his hands and say, "See?
>A perverted fag! Obviously that explains his twisted views."
>If I say I'm *not* gay, it gives the impression that I am rising
>to the challenge of a perceived "insult", and am concerned with
>not having people think I'm one of "them".
>Let's just say that my sexuality has little to do with the issue
>at hand, which, to my mind, is the objectionability of his
>diatribes against "fags" and "dykes".
>By they way, is there anyone else you'd like to smear, while we're
>at it? How about niggers, kikes, spics, or gooks, etc.? Are they
>also inferior species, still on their way up to Divine Homerhood?

     My concern with whether or not you are gay is an interesting one.

     If you WERE gay I would feel at peace because I understand that
gays have a certain world view and I have long given up on trying
to change it.  They have their own life that is very alien to mine,
(actually not totally alien) and I usually sidestep trying to engage
in philosophical aguements with them because they are adamant Mortals
who seem to WANT to be mortal and it is not my position to change them.

     My problem is I do not realy understand your hostility to Adorian
vies.  Most of the people I know find them facsinating, possible and highly
desirable even if not perfect. Yet.  You on the other hand seem to be
permanently on the rag, you can find nothing right about a single word
I have ever said which makes you very suspect and I don't really see
where you could possibly coming from.  If you were gay that would
explain things.

     Gays and lesbians tend to think of men and women as equals, they
tend to not relate to the idea that women defend the children and men
defend the women, in fact they find this whole idea insulting.

     They tend to either be highly religious or highly anti religious
but in either case have little sympathy for the idea they were
ever a body of the opposite sex.

     Whereas much of Adorian philosophy is directed at the problem that
many women have of not being able to be a man, lesbian women don't consider
that they want to be a man, so all of that part of Adore is foreign to them.

     Gays are also usually of the opinion that all people are of equal worth,
within a race and across races and that the more able should support the
less able.

     My susupicions of your own personal gaydom arise from the virulence
with which you use the word homophobe and with which you defend women
as equal to men.

     On the first point, it is foreign to me to find purely heterosexual
men so up in arms about negative views about gays.  It doesn't effect them
or so they think, and so they tend to agree or disagree with the subject
with a certain emotional noncomittance.  Of course many het men totally
detest gays.  Usually when someone gets all up in arms about homophobes
it is because they themselves have been affected by the issue either
because their friends are gay or they are gay themselves and have had
to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune that society
throws at gays.  One does not get as mad as you have without having
suffered some of the oppression yourself.  No?

     Being totally without understand about the true nature of
pure mono homo sexuals, people who can not get into the other sex at all,
I have come to accept that they are they way they are and I tend to
leave them alone.  They seem to have little interest in future lives
as a body of the opposite sex and less interest in past lives as a body
of the opposite sex.

     Hets however can be interested very quickly in this subject as
they are deeply interested in BEING and in INTERACTING with both sexes
both sexually and otherwise.

     Since the Adorian view is that all spirits are trans sex beings,
meaning they have BOTH sexes included in them and that the basic screw up
that happened millions of years ago was an uncontrolled split between the
two sexual aspects of the being along with the God and the child aspect,
it always strikes and Adorian as slightly weird when a being refuses to
discuss the matter of having been the opposite sex before and possibly
getting to the opposite sex again in another life.

     However gays are in a class by themselves, and in fact if you
ARE gay I would much rather discuss YOUR point of view of the world
and not the Adorian view as Adore does not have it in for Gays, although
I possibly have it in for Dykes, but hell I'm not perfect.

     Gays have a distince problem that is symetrical with the same
problem that hets have.  Gays have zero comprehension of how pure hets
feel about gays.  Gays are always assigning incorrect whys concerning
hets behavior and distastes towards gays, and gays tend to revile in their
misunderstanding of why they are persecuted so.

     They also make little progress changing it because they havn't a clue
as to why hets feel the way they do.

     In summary I have found that people who have zero interest in
becoming the opposite sex or in their possible past lives AS the opposite
sex are not suitable people to get into a war over Adorian ideas.
Conceivably Adorian ideas don't even apply to them.

     For the record although I am 100 percent into girls, I am not
100 percent NOT into men.  The percentage is low, but real.
Thus my interest in gay issues, and my very unpleasant soujourn on
GAYNET which if you ARE gay is a good place to be.  They have little
tolerance for dischord there however.

     However I do have this strong interest in females, which perhaps
is part of my strong dislike for Dykes who arn't into men at all, and
also my strong interest in the subject of rearing children in the
absence of one parent of one or the other sex.

     I also have a real intense hatred for women who have the attitude that
'...if I were a man I would get a sex change operation.'  Real quote.
Real schmuck.

     If I were a woman I would be a dyke.  Hell, what can I say.  I am
into women.

 Homer               Adore-l list         9/25/89*Homer wants to know if I'm ga